Ferrari Mailing List: Re: GM products, was: Re: 1978 GTS Rear Brake Caliper question

[scott saidel (scott_saidel]

I care about stereo sound quality - at least in my commute.  Got a decent rig by upgrading from the LX to the EX Civic.  Nothing mind blowing but like all other things automotive a Huge improvement for a factory rig. 

Personally, as a stereo guy, I have low expectations for car audio. Can't think of a worse environment for decent sound quality - curved glass reflecting and distorting sound while carpets and cushions absorb it.  Best you can hope for is decent speaker placement and direct line speaker to ear - at least for highs and mids.  

That being said even the Honda is acceptable. Would go as far as saying the burmeister in my dad's S class is good to very good. Might even rate excellent with better cones.  But that was an option that cost as much as my whole Honda (which is totally wasted on my 83year old, mostly deaf, father.)

Sort of on the subject is Car Tech in general. I was amazed at how fast things like keyless entry and start and Bluetooth integration made it to even entry level cars. Got all the dodads in the civic for about $22k.  And would not want to live without them.  Heck, I get cranky when I have to press a button on the key fob to unlock my wife's 6 year old ml350. And you have to actually stick the key in the ignition- barbarian like. 

But still, if it were in the budget, I'd trade all the conveniences to daily drive an Elise with weak to poor a/c in the Florida summer.

But I am that kind of crazy. 

Scottie 

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 1, 2017, at 7:43 AM, Fellippe Galletta <fellippe.galletta [at] gmail.com> wrote:

Door panels matter if you care about stereo sound quality. :)

In that regard, the Vettes have come a long way.

FG

On Sun, Oct 1, 2017 at 8:46 AM, Lashdeep Singh via Ferrari <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> wrote:

GP, most cars are built to a budget. 

An engineering team spends the money on components that are important.  They wouldn't prioritize door panels and chassis geometry or powertrain development equally. 

Maybe in a Pagani but not in a Chevrolet or a Triumph.

The Corvette guys spent the $$$ on powertrain and chassis. They likely didn't have much of their budget left for door panels.

The C4s spanked most of their competition on track and looked very nice while doing it.

The Triumph engineers spent their budget on whiskey and cricket jerseys as is evident in their product.

The C6 ZR1 has a plastic key FOB but you can't infer anything about the rest of the car's quality or performance from that. Carbon brakes, magnetic shocks and Magnesium chassis parts got the $$$ and the key FOBs had to suffer.

Evaluate performance cars based on their performance!

LSJ

On Sep 29, 2017, at 06:39, George <ygpz4re [at] hotmail.com> wrote:

And the door panel was really just an example of what I perceive (rightly or wrongly) to be shoddy workmanship on GM's part.  I mean, if a 30+ year old *Triumph* (possibly the cheapest of all cheap *BRITISH* sports cars) can keep its door panels securely in place, why can't GM's flagship sports car??  Where else have they cut corners to build to a price?  What else will just fall apart?  And as you point out Charles - this particular problem was after the rework....

So, if my wife ever did talk me into  buying her a Chevy (not very likely), I might like it initially, but would be ever wary of when things will just start to break.  Her former Monte Carlo not withstanding (that was a good and very nice, comfy - and quick! - car).

FWIW, YMMV, yadda yadda...

gp

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From: Charles Perry <charles [at] carolina-sound.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2017 10:50 AM
To: George
Cc: The FerrariList
Subject: RE: GM products, was: Re: 1978 GTS Rear Brake Caliper question

 

I will concede you that fact, George. My C4 Corvette (1985 Z51) has possibly the worst POS door panels of any car ever built, and I am including my neighbor’s amateur race cars which include a lot of old real estate signs and pallets as structural components. Even the aftermarket replacement C4 door panels make a Papa John’s pizza look rigid, and even including additional aftermarket brackets they still pop off the door structure every time you close the door. Without question: Worst. Car part. Ever.

 

And your friend’s 96 was AFTER they had an interior re-work to update the C4 from mine.

 

I had considered trying to fab my own from fiberglass, but I am currently derailed by the car’s need for new fuel pumps.

 

 

 

From: Ferrari [mailto:ferrari-bounces+charles=carolina-sound.com@ferrarilist.com] On Behalf Of George
Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2017 11:05 AM
To: Charles Perry
Cc: The FerrariList
Subject: [Ferrari] GM products, was: Re: 1978 GTS Rear Brake Caliper question

 

I find Charles' comments interesting, but won't let my wife read them (she's a Chevy gal from way back).  She's constantly PO'd that I won't buy her a Chevy, even though her old Monte Carlo Z34 (1998 MY) was still in great shape and going strong at 204K miles when we sold it a decade or so back.

 

To me, Chevy has always been a maker of pretty darn good engines - but the rest of the car sucked.  A very good friend has a '96 'Vette with a great LT4 engine, but also with a floppy inner driver's side door panel.  Even my former POS Triumph Spitfire (RIP), at almost *20 YEARS* older than the 'Vette, didn't have a floppy door panel.  WTF Chevy???

 

So I'm curious to see how Charles' CTS-V holds up over time, WRT build quality.  I suspect the engine will be like the energizer bunny....

 

And in that vein, I'll be happy to hear of *UNRESTORED* examples of vintage GM products that are as good as the day they first rolled out of the showroom.  I'll start - her Monte Carlo was darn close, even the leather upholstery was just broken in (almost 10 years and, as mentioned above, 204K miles).  Wondering if that's the exception or now the rule?

 

But as long as she uses *MY* good credit to buy a car, I still get a say in what that car is.  😉

 

gp

 

---

From: Charles Perry <charles [at] carolina-sound.com>

I find it surprisingly hard to argue. I never in my life thought I?d want a Camaro, but the ZL1 1LE is absolutely a phenomenally developed car all around and I?d love to have one as a track car.

Felt the same way a couple of years ago ? would never have pictured owning a Cadillac, but my CTS-V 6MT wagon has been huge fun and nearly zero trouble.

It will be years before my track driving talent matches the capabilities of our C7 Z06 Corvette.

GM praise always used to be preceded by the phrase ?For the money?? but that?s just not the case anymore. World class in everything except maybe interior materials, and they?re just not far enough off to dissuade me from GM any more.

 

 

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