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Re: Someone is about to get burned
From: Buxton Motorsports, Inc. Gmail (buxtonmotorsportsgmail.com)
Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2022 14:11:17 -0700 (PDT)
I’m sure this service was performed at a dealer. And you know they don’t just do a belt, tensioner and water pump. They will replace every rubber hose, every belt, spark plugs and cap / rotor / plug wires, brake pads, all fluids, tires, alignment etc etc. not saying that is what should happen but it does happen.  I think $10k is high as well but it sounds like this seller does everything so there are no questions and no negotiating.  

Brian E. Buxton
Buxton Motorsports, Inc. 
Auto Acquisitions & Consulting
Evansville, IN


Mailing Address:
5411 State Route 261
Unit 903
Newburgh, IN 47629-0923

(812) 760-5513 

www.BuxtonMotorsports.com
www.BuxtonMotorsports.net

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On Apr 2, 2022, at 4:44 AM, BRITT ROTHMAN <britt2asa [at] aol.com> wrote:

An average 328 requiring a belt service and water pump would cost 2500 USD to service in the U.K. , not 10k dollars in the U.K. unless they are using some secret gold plated pieces unique to USA market cars it really feels like you guys that own Ferraris in the USA are being completely shafted on labour rates. I still call BS. If it cost that much to fix a few items what else will come out and fail because the car has been sitting for so long? Stupid price and stupid to buy such a car but I guess it’s their money to spend ( and my opinion to share)




And these are only a few places I found that have a website. Any good independent and almost all main dealers will match these prices because they want the work on the older cars. Long long way from 10k dollars for a belt service. Must be lack of competition or something but even here in Sweden, at a terrible exchange rate and a 25% sales tax, the 512tr service is listed at 5000 dollars plus extra unforeseen stuff. And that’s a full engine out job……. ( so about the same price at Ferrari of Atlanta charged with much lower costs for salaries and taxes). 

BR in Stockholm

Sent from my iPad

On 2 Apr 2022, at 09:48, Brian E. Buxton <buxtonmotorsports [at] gmail.com> wrote:



From the comments section the seller also posted "When looking at the current $39K service bill, it must be noted that $9K of the total invoice was paying the previous shop’s storage fees. A good portion of this invoice is for work that goes over and above the common service work; such as the exterior and interior detail work, re-building the hood struts to preserve the original Ferrari script, instead of replacing them with modern and generic struts, sourcing the proper original heater valves to be fit to the vehicle so the original interior switches will function properly. These details, as well as a handful of others, are what we felt the car deserved. Preserving the originality of the vehicle was our focus, even if that meant additional costs above a routine service were incurred.

If this was just another average 328, the necessary service work, timing belts, etc. would have been about $10K. However, because of the overall originality, low mileage, and ownership history, this 328 is very different and it deserved the extra attention to detail."




On 4/2/22 1:55 AM, Peter Rychel wrote:

If you read through the service invoices, you’ll find that they went through the whole fuel system, which on a car that has been sitting for prolonged periods of time, it will need.

 

The Bosch K-Jetronic is an amazing system, but is primarily mechanical. When I was looking for a 328 last year, nearly every example had running/starting issues ( even the one Dominic & Lash looked at for me in Connecticut). It’s amazing, but incredibly complex that if one subsystem is “off”, it throws the whole thing out of whack and doesn’t run right. Common failures are the warm-up regulator, fuel pump, pump check-valve, idle air bypass device and finally the fuel distributor (which on US cars runs off a signal from an O2 sensor and ECU to control fuel flow/pressure levels to trim emissions output) . All of these items will feature rubber O-rings/seals that regardless of mileage, will degrade, usually from exposure to the fuel (especially today’s ethanol mixes which seem to be everywhere). If you’re paying someone to do all of the Re&Re work, crack open the wallet, because none of those parts are cheap and neither is the time. Hell, I even had to replace the fuel pressure regulators on my Mondial last year and it could’ve cost over $1400 in parts alone! I found aftermarket replacements for way less and it’s been running great, but people are ignorant, or kidding themselves if they expect these fuel-related items to last forever (they don’t...).

 

( https://www.ferrariparts.co.uk/part/ferrari/137960  but these are the same spec but made from Stainless and with Viton rubber diaphragms for fuel resistance:  https://herko.com/Retail/new-fuel-pressure-regulator-herko-pr4061-for-various-vehicles-1972-1998.html )

 

The invoices also note major work to the ventilation system which again, reveal parts that have been adapted to make it work because the originals are NLA and replacements didn’t work properly! I’ve got the 328 manual, there are several pages devoted just to adjusting the LED switches to turn the thing on and off and set the temperature! And Ferrari had TWO versions of these switches during the production of the 328! Oh ya, they were also used in the Testarossa and 412. I wonder how many of those are still working...

 

Peter

 

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From: BRITT ROTHMAN via Ferrari
Sent: April 1, 2022 1:13 AM
To: PeterGT4
Cc: The FerrariList
Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Someone is about to get burned

 

You know guys, I had a 328gts for 7 happy years. And if somebody wants to pay stupid money for one then so be it. Not worth that money to me in a million years but I guess if you have more money then you can spend you don’t care….

However, that aside I have restored, to a proper level over 20 cars, mostly Italian and I learned from the best in the U.K. I have to say I don’t understand how you can spend 39k dollars to do the work listed in the advert unless US shop prices are a supreme ripoff, OR 2. There is more work being required than listed. And then the question is why? I had 80k miles on my 328 and it didn’t require the majority of work listed. And a cam belt service at any number of shops in the U.K. with a water pump rebuild is still less than 1500k GBP ( including 20% VAT) and a 3-4 day job. ( so about 2200.00 USD). So I don’t know what the hell somebody paid 39k for but sounds like utter BS to me but then hey, it’s their money  ( of course at that rate it soon will be everyone else’s money but stupid is what stupid does).
The second point however and I stand by this - the underside of that car with the pictures shown is many many times lower than I would expect for a car with this miles and that price. That car wouldn’t even get to start to compete at the FOC concours in the U.K. ( I entered many times) and there are at least a dozen 328s I know personally in the U.K. alone in much better condition both from the engine bay pictures and the underneath that are valued for insurance purposes at about 120k USD. My point is, that is not a “nice” car. I can see it in the pictures and I assume it’s worse in person. The seller and the buyer either don’t understand what a “nice” clean car is or they didn’t care. But that car is not even close to the condition that warrant 1/3 of the price. I really don’t think people understand what I good Ferrari looks like OR the market in the US is so distorted compared to the Euro market that this is “normal” for us buyers. Glad I don’t live there anymore (at least for the Ferrari market).

And yes, anybody can spend what they want on what they want so don’t reply and tell me that. I’m just saying that whoever bought that thing must either not know or not care but nobody is going to tell me the car is nice or in good condition. (And my 328 was a lhd which are worth less in the U.K. than RHD).

Changing subject:

I’m taking the 512tr (ex-Clyde) to it’s big import inspection on Tuesday. wish me luck! It’s very strict, very long and without it I can’t use the car here. The snow has cleared enough that I can get it to the inspection station. Once inspected I can get plates and then it’s a summer of Scandinavian driving for the ex Atlanta car!

BR in Stockholm

Sent from my iPad

> On 31 Mar 2022, at 23:23, Robert Garven <rgarven [at] gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I respectfully disagree!  Ha That price is insane, I wonder what this earlier handbuilt fully restored much rarer
>  car with real carburetors would sell for!
>

IMG_7653.jpeg

>
>
>
> The 328 is the best of the 3 series across the board to include the 348/355/360
> Classic Pinn design
>
>
>
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