Ferrari Mailing List: Re: Disaster Averted, though I still have a problem!

[E M (pokiebaron]

Oh don't say things like that Doug, I've become very fond of the tick tick
sound of my old, and high mileage Benz. hee hee.  Fingers crossed until
Spring, when the head comes off and off to the machine shop for new valve
guides. ;-)

Ed
911SC

2008/11/9 Doug and Terri Anderson <dnt [at] dock.net>

> Ahhhh - snapped off heads.  OK.  Usually caused by poor valve stem cooling
> as a result of failed valve guides.  Engine starts tick tick tickin' as if
> it has incorrect valve lash but its not - then PING.  Ratlely ratelly poo
> poo clunk.
> Thanks
> DOUG
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <rolindsay [at] yahoo.com>
> To: "Doug and Terri Anderson" <dnt [at] dock.net>
> Cc: "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
> Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2008 10:28 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Disaster Averted, though I still have a problem!
>
>
> > That was my concern. My old '61 M-B has Na filled valves. Failure mode is
> > snapped off heads.
> > Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: "Doug and Terri Anderson" <dnt [at] dock.net>
> >
> > Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2008 10:10:19
> > To: rolindsay<rolindsay [at] yahoo.com>
> > Cc: The FerrariList<ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Disaster Averted, though I still have a problem!
> >
> >
> > Jim - what fails on sodium valves?  Not disagreeing with Ferrari history,
> > but Porsche has used sodium exhaust valves for, um, since the early 50's
> > and
> > that isn't known to be one of their weak links.
> > DOUG
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "jim" <jimshadow [at] verizon.net>
> > To: "DOUG" <dnt [at] dock.net>
> > Cc: "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2008 8:40 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Disaster Averted, though I still have a problem!
> >
> >
> >> Rick,
> >>
> >> I want to GET RID of the NA filled exhaust valves that are currently in
> >> my
> >> motor...they are prone to fail.  My thinking is that if I'm going to
> pull
> >> the motor I may as well take that preventive step....its something that
> >> I'm
> >> kicking around in my head.    I spoke to a very well known mechanic who
> >> currently has a motor on his bench that threw a sodium valve at low
> >> speed.
> >> The motor had been out recently but the owner decided not to do them at
> >> that
> >> time....   Its just something that's always in the back of my mind,
> >> especially given how much I drive the car.
> >>
> >> JIM
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: rolindsay [at] yahoo.com [mailto:rolindsay [at] yahoo.com]
> >> Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2008 11:18 AM
> >> To: jim; ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com
> >> Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Disaster Averted, though I still have a problem!
> >>
> >>
> >> May I just say;  DAMN!
> >>
> >> So glad you caught that!  In fact, the nut on the front of the
> >> crankshaft -
> >> holding the harmonic balancer in place - did the same thing on my E30M3.
> >> The
> >> balancer wobbled and chewed up the end of the crankshaft - and
> >> replacements
> >> aren't available. Estimate to repair IF a USED crank could be found was
> >> $25,000!  That ended my love afair with M3s.
> >>
> >> As for your car; yes you are very lucky. That's where belts fail, not at
> >> the
> >> larger diameter cam gear/pulley. I still have my failed belt as a
> >> "maintenance reminder." It has about 8 teeth sheared off the belt.  Just
> >> enough to allow the drive gear to spin freely.
> >>
> >> Jim, why the push to install fancy Na-filled exhaust valves?  Do you
> >> track
> >> it at all? Stock valves should cool adequately in any normal use.  That
> >> car
> >> is easily as quick, if not quicker than my 308GTB.  I wouldn't mess with
> >> success. :-)
> >>
> >> Better quit typing. Thumbs tired. :-P
> >>
> >> Rick
> >>
> >> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: "jim" <jimshadow [at] verizon.net>
> >>
> >> Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2008 10:59:10
> >> To: rolindsay<rolindsay [at] yahoo.com>
> >> Cc: The FerrariList<ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
> >> Subject: [Ferrari] Disaster Averted, though I still have a problem!
> >>
> >>
> >> Well, it was bound to happen sooner or later....
> >>
> >> Lets back track just a bit. Back in July I parked the GT4 to address a
> >> noise
> >> that I had tracked to my front bank tensioner bearing. They were last
> >> replaced 3yrs ago and I've put about 10-12,000 miles on her in the last
> >> 1.5
> >> yrs. (I DRIVE this little GT4!!!) Not wanting to have a belt failure, I
> >> decided to do the belts, bearings and give her a valve adjustment. All
> >> went
> >> well and I got it back together just in time to road test and drive it
> >> 1200
> >> miles r/t to Mississippi for the '308's in '08' Event. The car performed
> >> like a champ and the noise had all but disappeared, that is until I got
> >> down
> >> to the Memphis area. At the event I had Rick Lindsay and Ric Rainbolt
> >> give
> >> a
> >> listen. Both agreed that it sounded strange and that it was likely a
> >> bearing
> >> somewhere.
> >>
> >> Fast forward home and I'm out with a buddy grabbing coffee and going to
> >> see
> >> a '63 Vette with '96 internals and 700ish HP. (Keep in mind that i've
> not
> >> driven it since returning from the '308 Event but once). Well, that damn
> >> noise was back, but this time getting louder and sounding worse, much
> >> worse.
> >> Upon pulling into the 'Vette owners driveway I looked under the car and
> >> noticed black oil on my alternator and on the frame near the balancer
> >> which
> >> is not one of my usual leaks. So I limp the car home at 25mph and park
> >> it.
> >> Today I started taking things apart and found that my front bank lower
> >> drive
> >> gear was COMING OFF the shaft! I could spin the nut with my fingers. The
> >> only thing keeping it on was the belt cover. You can see in the pics
> >> where
> >> the gear was bumping into the cover and scoring it.
> >>
> >> The ironic thing is that I was just checking prices this past week on
> >> what
> >> it would cost to finally do the sodium valves as preventive maintenance,
> >> now
> >> this!
> >>
> >> I was convinced that the noise was my water pump bearing and I was going
> >> to
> >> be torqued that I didn't do a 'while i was in there' and rebuild it when
> >> I
> >> was doing the valve adjustment/belts. I was all ready to fire the car up
> >> today and get out my mechanics stethoscope to figure this out when that
> >> nut
> >> caught my eye. THANK GOODNESS that the gear did not let loose and throw
> >> my
> >> belt off!!! I'm grateful for that for sure. I'm confident that I can do
> >> the
> >> bearing job myself, however, I'm debating just pulling the motor and
> >> sending
> >> it off to get the head work done as well as the bearings and a couple
> >> other
> >> things....stay tuned and wish me luck!
> >>
> >> JIM
> >>
> >> (PS, my marks all line up, so no jumped belt teeth or anything like
> that.
> >> I
> >> could not feel any play in the gear other than the slightest in/out
> >> movement
> >> from that loose nut.....)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
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