Ferrari Mailing List: Re: The market

[Brian E. Buxton (BrianBuxton]

From the market trend I'd guess the next one to come to market will do $100M, or close.

-- 
Brian E. Buxton 

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On 12/8/18 1:14 PM, Robert W. Garven Jr. wrote:

I just wish I could live long enough to see the 250 GTO prices fall back down to $10,000!

Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 8, 2018, at 12:27 AM, Peter Rychel <dino308gt4 [at] hotmail.com> wrote:

Interesting replies for this topic. My very long and boring take (if anyone cares, maybe the ones who I named):

 

cLyDe:

 

"...The limited auction market isn’t the market

Maybe for you

But not the average Joe

The Ferrari market has always been about hype..."

 

&

 

"...Why isn’t there a blue book Price on an Ferrari like there is on every other car out there?

Why is the asking price considered the price ?..."

 

Me: You’re correct, but I highly doubt the majority of used, older-model Ferraris are selling at inflated asking prices anyways. BUYERS always knock the price down. Even for everyday cars, I’ve never heard of anyone paying the seller’s asking price for say, a 1990 Ford Taurus that has 201K mi on it and A/C that ain’t blowing cold, even if it’s driven by the proverbial little old lady. Back in 2000 I knocked the price down for my 308 from $30K to $25K (CDN! Equivalent to about $17K USD!!), only because I offered cash in my hand. Shit, had I considered buying a brand new Toyota Celica – and I was, I would’ve paid more! Who knows, maybe I was the stupid one and offered the most with my low ball amount @ $25K! Ha!

 

 

Dennis:

 

"...I think, as best as I know, that the car sold for VERY CLOSE to the sticker price for a 308 in 1985. Keep in mind that the car; 1) had 54,000 miles, 2) DID NOT have the original window sticker, had spotty service records from the early 90s, and 3) DID NOT have the original jack or tool kit (I made these myself). Also, as was pointed out to me, that I WAS NOT a factory certified Ferrari technician (although I am a retired ASE certified Master Technician and former master tech with two domestic car lines). Also, the paint was starting to show its age.

 

As the man who purchased the car from me said, "The 308s that are worth $100,000 now will still be worth whatever the equivalent of $100,000 is in the future." In other words, the cars (read: any Ferrari) with low miles, belt service done yesterday, all documentation, and with jack and tool kit will be the ones that bring the big bucks. And by his reckoning, that means the value will increase based on inflation (and maybe some attrition), as is the case now..."

 

Me: You point out many key things that I fall into the same camp. I have DIY’d my car since the day I bought it for two reasons: I’m a gearhead and I’ve tinkered since I was a kid. If I were a millionaire, I’d still get my hands dirty. The second reason relates to the first – I’m not a millionaire. If I took my car to the garage for everything, I’d be broke and in debt. I’d say a lot of interested buyers would be put off by a lack of “official” service records and the fact my car isn’t a #1, or a #2, but in the range of a #3 (mileage, cracked seat leather, paint chips, some aftermarket parts, etc). Yeah, I accept it, I have Hagerty and agreed valued it as a #3 and pay the respective premium for it. I’m not fooling myself that I have a $100K car as it never was and never will be. As you pointed out Dennis, the $100K cars are the garage queens that have never been driven, still have plastic wrap on the door edges and the original air in the tires. The investors buy those cars, everyone else buys the “real” cars.

 

Hans:

 

"...I sold my recently departed (2 years ago) 308GT4 to a very prominent used car dealer. The price he offered (well, not the first price he offered...) was pretty close to auction prices, and well over twice what I paid for it.

 

This is a dealer that routinely deals in million $$ cars. I assume he knows the market..."

 

I may look back at this and say I should’ve/would’ve/could’ve taken up your lead and sold my car at the height of pricing back then. On the other hand, I ask myself what would I have replaced it with? An “upgraded”, newer Ferrari but it would’ve still been at my blue-collar salary pricing and needing the same level of work that I did for my GT4. With my position in life, I’ll always have a #3 car, regardless of age and model. The money would’ve been nice but I don’t need money. My car is great and everything has been done to it, so I really shouldn’t sell it. I have trust in it, it’s only the routine maintenance to keep at it and that is very, very manageable. I have to be pragmatic. You did very well and it sounds like your Maser QP was a worthy – and better – replacement.

 

Luke:

 

"...Interesting, but, I disagree.  I am at the age past investing, but, I have advised my sons in Real Estate and quality.  It's a simply a supply and demand deal.  Older Ferraris in good shape; the Asian market alone could eat them up.  Purdy Shotguns, Parkers (I have one) diamonds, etc.  Ocean front, waterfront Properties, they never go down.  Invest in Quality guys..."

 

Me: Living here in Vancouver for many years and being immersed in Asian culture and having Asian friends, I can tell you, you can count on one hand the number of main land Chinese who like old cars. It’s just not in their culture, their aspiration and status is for the latest thing, not some “used” car. This is why the exotic dealers here do so well with the constant turn-over of vehicles (beyond the money laundering, which also has an influence too). If they’ll buy any older Ferrari (and they are the ones who have lived most of their lives here in North America and have absorbed the “collecting/keeping old things” mentality), it’ll be the blue chip garage queens and not some old 308 or Mondial. More supply than demand in this case.

 

Peter

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

 

 

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