Ferrari Mailing List: Re: [NFC] 2003 BMW M5?

[Brian E. Buxton (BrianBuxton]

I agree - but there must be something in the water - every time I am 
posting something you guys want to come back with some obscure, 
irrelevant comparison as a counter argument.  We were talking about 450+ 
horsepower performance sedans from AMG, NOT dump trucks or cloth 
interiored 6 cyl. stripper e-classes that are used for taxis (which 
behave completely differently than the high hp. versions).  If the AMG 
versions were fun to drive, reliable and marketable (as you stated), 
don't you guys think they would build them?  Why do you think they 
didn't sell manual trans. SL's and SLK's for very long in the US?  Why 
don't they have manual trans S-class cars?  Because the cars are too 
heavy, don't drive well and the buyers of those cars don't want to buy a 
large, heavy but fast luxo-barge with a manual.  Why do you think BMW 
was only offering the M5's with SMG's at first?  Because they were 
cheaper to build?  BUT, if the reason Mercedes does not sell manual 
trans. AMG models here in the states is because of market demand, I am 
also curious as to why you think they don't offer them in Europe 
either?  If there is a market there then the reason must be something 
other than that alone.

Mr.Wuss




Dennis Liu wrote:

> Dude, what are you smokin'?  The "cars are too heavy for a manual"?  Brian,
> MB *sells* cheap e-class sedans in other parts of the world WITH a *MANUAL
> TRANSMISSION*.  While the AMG may be a few pounds heavier than an E300, the
> reason MB doesn't sell them here with an automatic is not because of the
> car's WEIGHT.  Rather, it's a function of market demand - there aren't
> enough buyers for an E55 with a manual transmission, because, well, MB
> buyers are girls!!!!  BWAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!
>
> Seriously, MB took a look at the market, decided that a small % of E55 sales
> would be with a manual, and concluded that it wouldn't be worth the effort.
> True for almost its entire range here in the US (MB used to offer a manual
> in the SLK, dunno if they still do).
>
> As opposed to BMW, which offers a manual transmission in the 3-series,
> 5-series, 6-series, X3, X5, Z4 roadster and coupe, not to mention the Z8.
> And all of its M cars too (yeah, the new M5 and M6 are getting real 6-speed
> manuals).  
>
> That's because real men (and women) who know how to drive and appreciate the
> feel of a perfectly timed heel-toe downshift will always enjoy driving a
> sports car (or a sport sedan) with a manual transmission.  Whereas girls
> drive MBs.  :-)
>
> Kidding aside, go back and reread what I wrote.  I did not say that
> automatic trannies suck, simply that if I'm buying something that's a sports
> car, or a sports sedan, or even has pretentions of being such, ***I WANT A
> MANUAL***.  Heck, I've OWNED a couple of big German cars with automatics,
> and I've LOVED them.  And I've driven a variety of AMGs, and they sure were
> fun when you stepped on the gas.  But as a whole, they were soft, HEAVY, and
> blech.  I will probably always own a big German sedan, but I acknowledge
> that it is what it is - a big heavy sedan that's well suited for an
> automatic, perfect for sitting in traffic and hauling the family around.
>
> But if I wanted a SPORTS SEDAN with 500hp that SHOULD be fun to drive, I'm
> going to get one with a stick.  You wuss!  :-)
>
> Vty,
>
> --Dennis
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: Brian E. Buxton [mailto:BrianBuxton [at] BuxtonMotorsports.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 12:39 PM
> To: BigHeadDennis [at] earthlink.net
> Cc: The FerrariList
> Subject: Re: [Ferrari] [NFC] 2003 BMW M5?
>
>
> I may be a wuss, but have you driven one?  Mercedes new 5 and 7 speed
> trannies are *excellent,* and the cars are too heavy for a manual.
>
> Brian
>
>
> Dennis Liu wrote:
>
>
> 	Brian Buxton wrote:
> 	
> 	  
>
> 		The M5 is a great car ... I am more of a Mercedes-Benz
> person and
> 		    
>
> 	personally would opt for an 03 E55 AMG with 469 hp. & 516 ft.-lb.
> torque for
> 	about the same money.  But an M5 is a great way to haul 4 people
> around in
> 	comfort, safety and speed!  I think the price seems a bit high for
> the
> 	mileage, although the warranty is a plus that cannot easily be
> duplicated in
> 	the aftermarket ... but for just a few dollars more I can 
> 	get you about 38K LESS miles!
> http://www.buxtonmotorsports.com/10.php
> 	
> 	====================
> 	
> 	Ah, BMW v MB.  Another classic battle.  My $0.02 - the AMGs are for
> girls
> 	(and no, I don't mean females, I mean __GIRLS__).  Awesome concept,
> forever
> 	hobbled by that slushbox automatic transmission.  I think the most
> beautiful
> 	German sedan available now is the CLS, and I'd LOVE to have a CLS55,
> but
> 	ain't no way - not if I can only get an automatic.
> 	
> 	Now, don't get me wrong, I have nothing against automatics per se.
> It's
> 	just that if I'm buying a sports car, or even a big sedan that's
> ostensibly
> 	sporty in nature, then I want a damn manual transmission.  I love my
> 740iL
> 	with the auto, and I'm thinking about buying another one (or even a
> 750).
> 	But I'm not going to get the "M" version with an automatic.  I don't
> even
> 	like the SMG versions.  Heck, that's why the current M5 has been on
> my sh*t
> 	list, because the BMW SMG tranny bites it, big time.  And why I've
> been
> 	waiting and waiting and waiting for my 430, with a manual 6-speed
> (who knows
> 	if I'll EVER get one).
> 	
> 	Bottom line, the AMG is just plain ridiculous.  What's the point of
> all that
> 	power and stiff suspension if you can't enjoy driving the dang thing
> because
> 	of the slushbox?  Might as well get the E500/E550 (or CLS550) and
> save $15k.
> 	You'll still have every bit as much fun.
> 	
> 	AMG, Brian?  You wuss.  :-P
> 	
> 	Vty,
> 	
> 	--Dennis
> 	
> 	  
>
>
>
>
>  

--
Brian E. Buxton

President, Buxton Motorsports, Inc .
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