| Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct | <– Date –> <– Thread –> |
From: Hans E. Hansen (FList hanshansen.org)
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| Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 22:07:14 -0700 (PDT) | |
Uh, yeah. You are missing something there. Go in to a GM dealer and ask what is *actually* selling. It is the SUVs and pickups. Toyota is down 70%, with numerous boats sitting offshore waiting for the opportunity to unload the unwanted econoboxes. On Tue, May 19, 2009 at 9:24 PM, Michael James <cavallino_rapante [at] yahoo.com>wrote: > Am I missing something here? The 'Big Three' is now the 'Big 1.2', > Crysler/Chevy lots are chock-full of Trucks/SUVs that are NOT moving, > thousands of dealerships are closing, and makers of small, fuel-efficient > vehicles are experiencing growth and expanding market-share.....you can't be > implying that the market hasn't already spoken.... > > > > --- On Wed, 5/20/09, Jim <jimshadow [at] verizon.net> wrote: > > > From: Jim <jimshadow [at] verizon.net> > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem > extinct > To: "Michael" <Cavallino_Rapante [at] yahoo.com> > Cc: "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > Date: Wednesday, May 20, 2009, 12:08 AM > > > well, I happen to WANT my GL450 Merc, and I LIKE to drive it! (so does my > wife...its actually hers. :) ) > The funny thing is that CONSUMERS DEMAND these big vehicles....... > > I'm just sayin' > > JIM > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Steve Cook" <stevec [at] cheatcodes.com> > To: "JIM" <jimshadow [at] verizon.net> > Cc: "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 9:06 PM > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem > extinct > > > > You're missing the point entirely... > > > > The problem isn't with the manufacturers (well, they have problems, but > > this ain't it yet). Instead of solving the "problem" (people using too > > much gas), they're going after the manufacturers - who are only building > > what customers WANT. > > > > The correct solution is the go after the (alleged) problem - people > > using too much gas (in the government's opinion). The direct solution > > would be to charge people more for gas (via taxes). It's already PROVEN > > that when the price is higher, people use less and WANT more fuel > > efficient cars. Instead they come up with crazy plans of more > > governmental and bureaucratic control using arbitrary and unproven > > numbers. > > > > -steve > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: philville dejazzd.com [mailto:philville [at] dejazzd.com] > > Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 6:51 PM > > To: Steve Cook > > Cc: The FerrariList > > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem > > extinct > > > > > > I think that on this list alone there is enough creative talent to > > build a better mouse trap...... > > bigger, better faster handles like a great car should and even > > stopss shorter.and, with fuel economy that will make you stop and > > wonder why it took so long...... > > > > As they say think outside of the cylinder............ > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Rick <Forza355 [at] verizon.net> > > Date: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 8:46 pm > > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just made > > them extinct > > To: Phil Tegtmeier <philville [at] dejazzd.com> > > Cc: The FerrariList <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > > > We have had the General Motors EV1 Electric car as a New > > > technology that > > > everyone was supposed to go gaga over an buy instead of a > > > gas car. Well it > > > flopped. > > > We have had GW preachers telling us for over a decade now > > > that we need to > > > stop using gas guzzling cars, then Al Gore jumps in his suburban > > > and rushes > > > of to an airport to fly in his G-2 Kerosene guzzling jet, > > > to another GW > > > conference somewhere around the globe. Meanwhile his home in > > > Tenn has a $ > > > 30,000.00 a year electric bill that has to be supplied by > > > Nuclear energy or > > > Coal burning power plants. > > > Now we have his protege BO eager to force us to drive golf carts > > > with higher > > > fatality rates . Who cares about higher death rates wen you are > > > saving so > > > much gas, right? > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "philville dejazzd.com" <philville [at] dejazzd.com> > > > To: "Rick" <Forza355 [at] verizon.net> > > > Cc: "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > > > Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 8:34 PM > > > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just made > > > them extinct > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I say BS, if you all think that creative thinking > > > has been encouraged > > > > and allowed to produce what we want and what we > > > need then you need > > > > to get your head out of the sand. There is no > > > doubt in my mind that > > > > the ability to move a 4000 lb. car at highway > > > speeds comparable to our > > > > current usage and at mileage above 50 mpg. The > > > problem being that > > > > those who control the technology are those who did > > > not want this. Why > > > > would they? > > > > > > > > "Never did like the idea of govt deciding what > > > kind of cars we'll > > > > have. If a > > > > large part of the public wants electric cars there > > > would be *someone* > > > > producing them." > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: LarryT <l02turner [at] comcast.net> > > > > Date: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 7:41 pm > > > > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Say goodbye to your SUV's : > > > BO just made them > > > > extinct > > > > To: Phil Tegtmeier <philville [at] dejazzd.com> > > > > Cc: The FerrariList <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > > > > > the article said <<components such as air > > > conditioners and > > > > > power steering > > > > > pumps are powered by electricity rather than by > > > the engine, > > > > > saving fuel.>> > > > > > > > > > > There's a cost associated with the electricity > > > too - sounds like > > > > > they're > > > > > glossing over that little problem. It will > > > reduce the > > > > > amount of gas savings > > > > > significantly. IMO. Maybe obama > > > could declare we > > > > > smust all work at night > > > > > and reduce our AC needs?? > > > > > > > > > > Never did like the idea of govt deciding what > > > kind of cars we'll > > > > > have. If a > > > > > large part of the public wants electric cars > > > there would be > > > > > *someone* > > > > > producing them. > > > > > > > > > > I wonder how long before they start finding ways > > > to get rid of > > > > > older cars? > > > > > > > > > > LarryT > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://www.nrahq.org/nrabonus/accept-membership.asp > > > > > > > > > > Free 1 year NRA membership to anyone interested! > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Rick" <Forza355 [at] verizon.net> > > > > > To: "Larry Turner" <l02turner [at] comcast.net> > > > > > Cc: "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 7:02 PM > > > > > Subject: [Ferrari] Say goodbye to your SUV's : > > > BO just made them > > > > > extinct > > > > > > > > > > > No dout banning 7 series BMW's and > > > large Benz & > > > > > lexus imports is next. > > > > > > Coffin cars with 2 stroke Brings & > > > Stratton engines are > > > > > coming your way > > > > > > in 4 years.Imagine what penalties we criminals > > > that drive gas > > > > > guzzling > > > > > > sports cars will face under the BO gestapo soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://apnews.myway.com/article/20090519/D989J3F00.html> > > > > > > > > DETROIT (AP) - Some soccer moms will have to > > > give up hulking > > > > > SUVs. > > > > > > Carpenters will still haul materials around in > > > pickup trucks, > > > > > but they > > > > > > will cost more. Nearly everybody else will > > > drive smaller cars, > > > > > and more of > > > > > > them will run on electricity. The higher > > > mileage and emissions > > > > > standards > > > > > > set by the Obama administration on Tuesday, > > > which begin to > > > > > take effect in > > > > > > 2012 and are to be achieved by 2016, will > > > transform the > > > > > American car and > > > > > > truck fleet. > > > > > > The new rules would bring new cars and trucks > > > sold in the > > > > > United States to > > > > > > an average of 35.5 miles per gallon, about 10 > > > mpg more than > > > > > today's > > > > > > standards. Passenger cars will be required to > > > get 39 mpg, > > > > > light trucks 30 > > > > > > mpg. > > > > > > > > > > > > That means cars and trucks on American roads > > > will have to > > > > > become smaller, > > > > > > lighter and more efficient. > > > > > > > > > > > > Eric Fedewa, vice president of global > > > powertrain forecasting > > > > > for the auto > > > > > > consulting firm CSM Worldwide in Northville, > > > Mich., said the > > > > > changes will > > > > > > make pickup trucks so much more expensive that > > > they will be > > > > > used almost > > > > > > exclusively for work. > > > > > > > > > > > > And instead of a minivan or SUV, more parents > > > will haul their > > > > > families in > > > > > > much smaller vehicles with three rows of seats > > > - something > > > > > more like the > > > > > > Mazda 5 small van, he said. The Mazda 5 gets > > > about 28 mpg on > > > > > the highway. > > > > > > > > > > > > "I think what you'll see is a lot more > > > creativity in interior > > > > > packaging," > > > > > > Fedewa said. "You'll get more rows of seats > > > where you > > > > > traditionally had > > > > > > cargo space." > > > > > > > > > > > > Already on Tuesday, some drivers were > > > skeptical. Dixie Bishop, > > > > > who runs a > > > > > > plumbing business in San Antonio that uses > > > vans, worries the > > > > > new > > > > > > requirements will drive up her costs at a time > > > when customers > > > > > are cutting > > > > > > back on repairs. > > > > > > > > > > > > "Are they going to take my horsepower down?" > > > she asked. "I > > > > > have to be able > > > > > > to carry old water heaters and toilets. It's > > > not beneficial > > > > > for me to haul > > > > > > one water heater at a time. We need the power > > > to pull these > > > > > heavy items." > > > > > > > > > > > > The changes will start with smaller cars and > > > trucks, and > > > > > improvements to > > > > > > the internal combustion engine, Fedewa said. > > > Automakers also > > > > > already > > > > > > working on new technology, including direct > > > fuel injection and > > > > > high > > > > > > compression of the air-fuel mixture, that will > > > make cars and > > > > > trucks more > > > > > > efficient. > > > > > > > > > > > > Car companies are rewiring vehicles so > > > components such as air > > > > > conditioners > > > > > > and power steering pumps are powered by > > > electricity rather > > > > > than by the > > > > > > engine, saving fuel. > > > > > > > > > > > > And they're developing computer-controlled > > > transmissions with > > > > > six or more > > > > > > gears, adding efficiency, and rolling out more > > > gas-electric > > > > > hybrids - > > > > > > among the few cars sold today that meet the > > > 2016 standards. > > > > > > > > > > > > Of course, developing the technology will cost > > > money - > > > > > billions of > > > > > > dollars - and automakers will pass that on to > > > their customers. > > > > > > > > > > > > The Obama administration says the changes mean > > > the average > > > > > vehicle would > > > > > > cost about $1,300 more, although some private > > > analysts say the > > > > > increase > > > > > > will be much heftier. The administration says > > > gas savings will > > > > > make up the > > > > > > difference in about three years. > > > > > > > > > > > > Automakers have said they need stable, > > > relatively high > > > > > gasoline prices to > > > > > > create a market for electric vehicles. General > > > Motors fears > > > > > rolling out > > > > > > its rechargeable Chevrolet Volt next year with > > > gas at $2 per > > > > gallon. > > > > > > > > > > > > American consumers have already shown their > > > car-buying habits > > > > > can change > > > > > > rapidly depending on gas prices. When fuel > > > cost $4 a gallon > > > > > last summer, > > > > > > people flocked to smaller cars. Gas is much > > > cheaper now, and > > > > > sales of > > > > > > hybrids have plummeted. > > > > > > > > > > > > "The U.S. consumer has consistently chosen > > > performance over > > > > > fuel economy > > > > > > given the relatively low cost of fuel," David > > > Leiker, senior > > > > > automotive > > > > > > analyst for Robert W. Baird & Co. in > > > Milwaukee, wrote in a > > > > > note to > > > > > > investors. > > > > > > > > > > > > The Volt is designed to run 40 miles on > > > battery power when it > > > > > is fully > > > > > > charged. After that, a small internal > > > combustion engine kicks > > > > > in to > > > > > > generate electricity and keep the car going. > > > Other automakers > > > > > are working > > > > > > on similar systems. > > > > > > > > > > > > But the Volt is expected to sell for $35,000 > > > to $40,000, and > > > > > buyers may be > > > > > > unwilling to pay that much for a sedan, even > > > if tax credits > > > > > help ease the > > > > > > burden, unless gas prices soar. > > > > > > > > > > > > Rechargeable electric vehicles, which under > > > government> > calculations could > > > > > > get 100 mpg or more, will help automakers meet > > > the standards > > > > > and offset > > > > > > sales of larger, less-efficient models. > > > > > > > > > > > > Under Obama's plan, the sale of of electric > > > vehicles and plug- > > > > > in hybrids > > > > > > could also generate "super credits" that would > > > count as more > > > > > than one > > > > > > vehicle when an automaker determines its > > > average fuel economy > > > > > and > > > > > > emissions figures. > > > > > > > > > > > > The new rules cause manufacturers "to > > > accelerate their > > > > > technology plans, > > > > > > probably a little more aggressively than they > > > originally> > thought," said > > > > > > Tony Posawatz, who heads development of the > > > Volt's technology. > > > > > "For us, we > > > > > > feel comfortable that we've got choices." > > > > > > > > > > > > Just a few years ago, GM and other auto > > > executives were > > > > > doubtful they > > > > > > could meet even less stringent standards, but > > > Posawatz said > > > > > the technology > > > > > > has changed since then, especially with new > > > lithium-ion batteries. > > > > > > > > > > > > GM also is looking at electric trucks, which > > > may bring them > > > > > even closer to > > > > > > the goals, he said. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier this year, Toyota said it planned to > > > launch as many as > > > > > 10 new > > > > > > hybrid models worldwide by early 2010, and it > > > plans to bring a > > > > > new version > > > > > > of the Prius to the U.S. in the coming weeks. > > > Honda's new > > > > > Insight hybrid > > > > > > is already on sale in the U.S. Mazda, > > > meanwhile, has said it > > > > > plans to > > > > > > focus less on hybrid vehicles and more on > > > improvements to its > > > > > basic > > > > > > internal combustion engine. > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________> > > > > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/l02turner%40comca > > > st.net> > > > > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > > > > > and F1 Headlines > > > > > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ <http://www.f1headlines.com/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________> > > > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/philville%40dejaz > > > zd.com > > > > > > > > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > > > > and F1 Headlines > > > > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ <http://www.f1headlines.com/> > > > > Philip "Phil" Tegtmeier > > > > 39 Churchill Drive, Elverson Pa 19520 > > > > 610.525.8949 > > > > Save these dates: > > > > September 12th & 13th 100 Motorcars of > > > Radnor Hunt > > > > fantastic 2 day event ......www.radnorconcours.org > > > ........> _________________________________________ > > > > September the 27th Garden State Ferrari Fall > > > Festival> __________________________________________ > > > > And of course, go to: > > > ................www.PhilvilleUSA.com <http://www.philvilleusa.com/>> > > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > > --------------- > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > > > > > > > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/forza355%40verizo > > n.net> > > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > > > and F1 Headlines > > > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ <http://www.f1headlines.com/> > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > > > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/philville%40dejaz > > zd.com > > > > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > > and F1 Headlines > > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ <http://www.f1headlines.com/> > > Philip "Phil" Tegtmeier > > 39 Churchill Drive, Elverson Pa 19520 > > 610.525.8949 > > Save these dates: > > September 12th & 13th 100 Motorcars of Radnor Hunt > > fantastic 2 day event ......www.radnorconcours.org ........ > > _________________________________________ > > September the 27th Garden State Ferrari Fall Festival > > __________________________________________ > > And of course, go to: > > ................www.PhilvilleUSA.com<http://www.philvilleusa.com/> > > _________________________________________________________________ > > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/jimshadow%40verizon.net > > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > and F1 Headlines > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ <http://www.f1headlines.com/> > > _________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/cavallino_rapante%40yahoo.com > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > and F1 Headlines > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ <http://www.f1headlines.com/> > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/flist%40hanshansen.org > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > and F1 Headlines > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ <http://www.f1headlines.com/> >
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Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct Michael James, May 19 2009
- Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct Jim Conforti, May 19 2009
- Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct Hans E. Hansen, May 19 2009
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Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct Michael James, May 19 2009
- Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct Hans E. Hansen, May 19 2009
- Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct Jim Conforti, May 20 2009
- Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct Michael James, May 20 2009
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