| Re: Don't read if you have had enough BS | <– Date –> <– Thread –> |
From: Steve Cook (stevec cheatcodes.com)
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| Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 09:14:04 -0700 (PDT) | |
Heheh just my opinions too J So, to summarize your first paragraph: "Eliminate everyone's freedom of choice because most people are stupid" is your rationale? For the second paragraph, you have to remember that it takes the SAME amount of ENERGY to move a 5000lb truck with gas or electric. It's ALWAYS going to be the same - it's a fundamental law of physics: Work = massXaccelerationXdistance. So you're merely shifting that energy from gas to something else. J -steve From: philville dejazzd.com [mailto:philville [at] dejazzd.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 9:42 AM To: Steve Cook Cc: The FerrariList Subject: Don't read if you have had enough BS JMHO Big govt. is rarely more than a short term solution and many times creates long term problems...having said that, I believe you are correct when you say that the manufs try to build what the buyers want. BUT, the buyers want what they have been traditionally sold they generally do not know any better, they are not all as tuned in as are we. Because there has never been ANY incentive for the manufacturer to sell us what we need they continue to build that which they have traditionally profited by ........ but too many can no longer afford to buy what they ( consumers) think they want. Now they have no alternative but to find a way to build us what we want in a form that is what we need.......reduced dependence on fossil fuels ( in which I include electricity )........ I truly believe I can have my Yukon and drive it too. I believe that Detroit can give me a 5000 lb. SUV with 8,000 to 10,000 lb towing capacity that can deliver over 50 MPG and carry 7/8 people with 2 cup holders per person...I believe that it can be as safe or safer than todays crop of anachronistic dinosaurs, I believe it can come with comfort and convenience accessories that will not destroy the abilities of the vehicle to provide us with good economy or efficiency ........bottom line I believe that we are the most creative country in the world and that the only things that ever hold us back are profit motive and lack of incentive. Let us listen to those creative people around us, look at their ideas, cut the crap and move on........then we all get back to making a profit. Phil ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Cook <stevec [at] cheatcodes.com> Date: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 9:06 pm Subject: RE: [Ferrari] NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct To: philville [at] dejazzd.com Cc: The FerrariList <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > You're missing the point entirely... > > The problem isn't with the manufacturers (well, they have > problems, but > this ain't it yet). Instead of solving the "problem" > (people using too > much gas), they're going after the manufacturers - who are only > buildingwhat customers WANT. > > The correct solution is the go after the (alleged) problem - people > using too much gas (in the government's opinion). The > direct solution > would be to charge people more for gas (via taxes). It's > already PROVEN > that when the price is higher, people use less and WANT more fuel > efficient cars. Instead they come up with crazy plans of more > governmental and bureaucratic control using arbitrary and unproven > numbers. > > -steve > > > -----Original Message----- > From: philville dejazzd.com [mailto:philville [at] dejazzd.com] > Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 6:51 PM > To: Steve Cook > Cc: The FerrariList > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just > madethemextinct > > > I think that on this list alone there is enough > creative talent to > build a better mouse trap...... > bigger, better faster handles like a great car > should and even > stopss shorter.and, with fuel economy that will > make you stop and > wonder why it took so long...... > > As they say think outside of the cylinder............ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Rick <Forza355 [at] verizon.net> > Date: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 8:46 pm > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] NFC Say goodbye to your > SUV's : BO just made > them extinct > To: Phil Tegtmeier <philville [at] dejazzd.com> > Cc: The FerrariList <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > > We have had the General Motors EV1 Electric car > as a New > > technology that > > everyone was supposed to go gaga over an > buy instead of a > > gas car. Well it > > flopped. > > We have had GW preachers telling us for > over a decade now > > that we need to > > stop using gas guzzling cars, then Al Gore jumps > in his suburban > > and rushes > > of to an airport to fly in his G-2 Kerosene > guzzling jet, > > to another GW > > conference somewhere around the globe. Meanwhile > his home in > > Tenn has a $ > > 30,000.00 a year electric bill that has to be > supplied by > > Nuclear energy or > > Coal burning power plants. > > Now we have his protege BO eager to force us to > drive golf carts > > with higher > > fatality rates . Who cares about higher death > rates wen you are > > saving so > > much gas, right? > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "philville dejazzd.com" > <philville [at] dejazzd.com> > To: "Rick" > <Forza355 [at] verizon.net> > Cc: "The FerrariList" > <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > Sent: Tuesday, May > 19, 2009 8:34 PM > > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Say goodbye to your SUV's > : BO just made > > them extinct > > > > > > > > > > I say BS, if you all think that > creative thinking > > has been encouraged > > > and allowed to produce what we want > and what we > > need then you need > > > to get your head out of the sand. > There is no > > doubt in my mind that > > > the ability to move a 4000 lb. car > at highway > > speeds comparable to our > > > current usage and at mileage above > 50 mpg. The > > problem being that > > > those who control the technology > are those who did > > not want this. Why > > > would they? > > > > > > "Never did like the idea of govt > deciding what > > kind of cars we'll > > > have. If a > > > large part of the public wants > electric cars there > > would be *someone* > > > producing them." > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: LarryT <l02turner [at] comcast.net> > > > Date: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 7:41 pm > > > Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Say goodbye > to your SUV's : > > BO just made them > > > extinct > > > To: Phil Tegtmeier > <philville [at] dejazzd.com> > > Cc: The > FerrariList <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > > > > the article said > <<components such as air > > conditioners and > > > > power steering > > > > pumps are powered by electricity > rather than by > > the engine, > > > > saving fuel.>> > > > > > > > > There's a cost associated with > the electricity > > too - sounds like > > > > they're > > > > glossing over that little > problem. It will > > reduce the > > > > amount of gas savings > > > > significantly. IMO. > Maybe obama > > could declare we > > > > smust all work at night > > > > and reduce our AC needs?? > > > > > > > > Never did like the idea of govt > deciding what > > kind of cars we'll > > > > have. If a > > > > large part of the public wants > electric cars > > there would be > > > > *someone* > > > > producing them. > > > > > > > > I wonder how long before they > start finding ways > > to get rid of > > > > older cars? > > > > > > > > LarryT > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://www.nrahq.org/nrabonus/accept-membership.asp > > > > > > > > Free 1 year NRA membership to > anyone interested! > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Rick" <Forza355 [at] verizon.net> > > > > To: "Larry Turner" > <l02turner [at] comcast.net> > > > Cc: > "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 7:02 PM > > > > Subject: [Ferrari] Say goodbye to > your SUV's : > > BO just made them > > > > extinct > > > > > > > > > No dout banning 7 series > BMW's and > > large Benz & > > > > lexus imports is next. > > > > > Coffin cars with 2 stroke > Brings & > > Stratton engines are > > > > coming your way > > > > > in 4 years.Imagine what > penalties we criminals > > that drive gas > > > > guzzling > > > > > sports cars will face under the > BO gestapo soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://apnews.myway.com/article/20090519/D989J3F00.html> > > > > > > > DETROIT (AP) - Some soccer moms > will have to > > give up hulking > > > > SUVs. > > > > > Carpenters will still haul > materials around in > > pickup trucks, > > > > but they > > > > > will cost more. Nearly > everybody else will > > drive smaller cars, > > > > and more of > > > > > them will run on electricity. > The higher > > mileage and emissions > > > > standards > > > > > set by the Obama administration > on Tuesday, > > which begin to > > > > take effect in > > > > > 2012 and are to be achieved by > 2016, will > > transform the > > > > American car and > > > > > truck fleet. > > > > > The new rules would bring new > cars and trucks > > sold in the > > > > United States to > > > > > an average of 35.5 miles per > gallon, about 10 > > mpg more than > > > > today's > > > > > standards. Passenger cars will > be required to > > get 39 mpg, > > > > light trucks 30 > > > > > mpg. > > > > > > > > > > That means cars and trucks on > American roads > > will have to > > > > become smaller, > > > > > lighter and more efficient. > > > > > > > > > > Eric Fedewa, vice president of global > > powertrain forecasting > > > > for the auto > > > > > consulting firm CSM Worldwide > in Northville, > > Mich., said the > > > > changes will > > > > > make pickup trucks so much more > expensive that > > they will be > > > > used almost > > > > > exclusively for work. > > > > > > > > > > And instead of a minivan or > SUV, more parents > > will haul their > > > > families in > > > > > much smaller vehicles with > three rows of seats > > - something > > > > more like the > > > > > Mazda 5 small van, he said. The > Mazda 5 gets > > about 28 mpg on > > > > the highway. > > > > > > > > > > "I think what you'll see is a > lot more > > creativity in interior > > > > packaging," > > > > > Fedewa said. "You'll get more > rows of seats > > where you > > > > traditionally had > > > > > cargo space." > > > > > > > > > > Already on Tuesday, some > drivers were > > skeptical. Dixie Bishop, > > > > who runs a > > > > > plumbing business in San > Antonio that uses > > vans, worries the > > > > new > > > > > requirements will drive up her > costs at a time > > when customers > > > > are cutting > > > > > back on repairs. > > > > > > > > > > "Are they going to take my > horsepower down?" > > she asked. "I > > > > have to be able > > > > > to carry old water heaters and > toilets. It's > > not beneficial > > > > for me to haul > > > > > one water heater at a time. We > need the power > > to pull these > > > > heavy items." > > > > > > > > > > The changes will start with > smaller cars and > > trucks, and > > > > improvements to > > > > > the internal combustion engine, > Fedewa said. > > Automakers also > > > > already > > > > > working on new technology, > including direct > > fuel injection and > > > > high > > > > > compression of the air-fuel > mixture, that will > > make cars and > > > > trucks more > > > > > efficient. > > > > > > > > > > Car companies are rewiring > vehicles so > > components such as air > > > > conditioners > > > > > and power steering pumps are > powered by > > electricity rather > > > > than by the > > > > > engine, saving fuel. > > > > > > > > > > And they're developing computer- > controlled > transmissions with > > > > six or more > > > > > gears, adding efficiency, and > rolling out more > > gas-electric > > > > hybrids - > > > > > among the few cars sold today > that meet the > > 2016 standards. > > > > > > > > > > Of course, developing the > technology will cost > > money - > > > > billions of > > > > > dollars - and automakers will > pass that on to > > their customers. > > > > > > > > > > The Obama administration says > the changes mean > > the average > > > > vehicle would > > > > > cost about $1,300 more, > although some private > > analysts say the > > > > increase > > > > > will be much heftier. The > administration says > > gas savings will > > > > make up the > > > > > difference in about three years. > > > > > > > > > > Automakers have said they need > stable, > relatively high > > > > gasoline prices to > > > > > create a market for electric > vehicles. General > > Motors fears > > > > rolling out > > > > > its rechargeable Chevrolet Volt > next year with > > gas at $2 per > > > gallon. > > > > > > > > > > American consumers have already > shown their > > car-buying habits > > > > can change > > > > > rapidly depending on gas > prices. When fuel > > cost $4 a gallon > > > > last summer, > > > > > people flocked to smaller cars. > Gas is much > > cheaper now, and > > > > sales of > > > > > hybrids have plummeted. > > > > > > > > > > "The U.S. consumer has > consistently chosen > > performance over > > > > fuel economy > > > > > given the relatively low cost > of fuel," David > > Leiker, senior > > > > automotive > > > > > analyst for Robert W. Baird & > Co. in > > Milwaukee, wrote in a > > > > note to > > > > > investors. > > > > > > > > > > The Volt is designed to run 40 > miles on > > battery power when it > > > > is fully > > > > > charged. After that, a small internal > > combustion engine kicks > > > > in to > > > > > generate electricity and keep > the car going. > > Other automakers > > > > are working > > > > > on similar systems. > > > > > > > > > > But the Volt is expected to > sell for $35,000 > > to $40,000, and > > > > buyers may be > > > > > unwilling to pay that much for > a sedan, even > > if tax credits > > > > help ease the > > > > > burden, unless gas prices soar. > > > > > > > > > > Rechargeable electric vehicles, > which under > > government> > calculations could > > > > > get 100 mpg or more, will help > automakers meet > > the standards > > > > and offset > > > > > sales of larger, less-efficient > models. > > > > > > > > > Under Obama's plan, the sale of > of electric > > vehicles and plug- > > > > in hybrids > > > > > could also generate "super > credits" that would > > count as more > > > > than one > > > > > vehicle when an automaker > determines its > > average fuel economy > > > > and > > > > > emissions figures. > > > > > > > > > > The new rules cause > manufacturers "to > > accelerate their > > > > technology plans, > > > > > probably a little more > aggressively than they > > originally> > thought," said > > > > > Tony Posawatz, who heads > development of the > > Volt's technology. > > > > "For us, we > > > > > feel comfortable that we've got > choices." > > > > > > > > > Just a few years ago, GM and > other auto > > executives were > > > > doubtful they > > > > > could meet even less stringent > standards, but > > Posawatz said > > > > the technology > > > > > has changed since then, > especially with new > > lithium-ion batteries. > > > > > > > > > > GM also is looking at electric > trucks, which > > may bring them > > > > even closer to > > > > > the goals, he said. > > > > > > > > > > Earlier this year, Toyota said > it planned to > > launch as many as > > > > 10 new > > > > > hybrid models worldwide by > early 2010, and it > > plans to bring a > > > > new version > > > > > of the Prius to the U.S. in the > coming weeks. > > Honda's new > > > > Insight hybrid > > > > > is already on sale in the U.S. Mazda, > > meanwhile, has said it > > > > plans to > > > > > focus less on hybrid vehicles > and more on > > improvements to its > > > > basic > > > > > internal combustion engine. > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________> > > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/l02turner%40comca > > st.net> > > > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > > > > and F1 Headlines > > > > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________> > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > > > > > > > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/philville%40dejaz > > zd.com > > > > > > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > > > and F1 Headlines > > > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ > > > Philip "Phil" Tegtmeier > > > 39 Churchill Drive, Elverson Pa 19520 > > > 610.525.8949 > > > Save these dates: > > > September 12th & 13th 100 > Motorcars of > > Radnor Hunt > > > fantastic 2 day event > ......www.radnorconcours.org > ........> > _________________________________________ > > > September the 27th Garden State Ferrari Fall > > Festival> > __________________________________________ > > > And of course, go to: > > ................www.PhilvilleUSA.com> > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------- > --------------- > > --------------- > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > > > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/forza355%40verizo > n.net> > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > > and F1 Headlines > > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please visit: > > > > http://lists.ferrarilist.com/mailman/options/ferrari/philville%40dejaz > zd.com > > > > Sponsored by BooyahMedia.com > > and F1 Headlines > > http://www.F1Headlines.com/ > Philip "Phil" Tegtmeier > 39 Churchill Drive, Elverson Pa 19520 > 610.525.8949 > Save these dates: > September 12th & 13th 100 Motorcars of Radnor Hunt > fantastic 2 day event ......www.radnorconcours.org > ........ _________________________________________ > September the 27th Garden State Ferrari Fall > Festival __________________________________________ > And of course, go to: > ................www.PhilvilleUSA.com Philip "Phil" Tegtmeier 39 Churchill Drive, Elverson Pa 19520 610.525.8949 Save these dates: September 12th & 13th 100 Motorcars of Radnor Hunt fantastic 2 day event ......www.radnorconcours.org ........ _________________________________________ September the 27th Garden State Ferrari Fall Festival __________________________________________ And of course, go to: ................www.PhilvilleUSA.com
- Last weekend, (continued)
- Last weekend Rick Lindsay, May 19 2009
- Re: NFC Say goodbye to your SUV's : BO just madethem extinct Jim, May 19 2009
- Re: NFC Media Suddenly discovers Smaller cars = Deadlier Rick, May 20 2009
- Don't read if you have had enough BS philville dejazzd.com, May 20 2009
- Re: Don't read if you have had enough BS Steve Cook, May 20 2009
- Re: Don't read if you have had enough BS Rick Lindsay, May 20 2009
- Re: Don't read if you have had enough BS philville dejazzd.com, May 20 2009
- Re: Don't read if you have had enough BS jimshadow, May 20 2009
- Re: Don't read if you have had enough BS Jim Conforti, May 20 2009
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