Ferrari Mailing List: Re: German Cars

[Michael James (cavallino_rapante]

I can understand that sentiment, however.....seems as though you've set 
yourself up for failure.  An M3 isn't even a consideration for me, as I regard 
the motor as too 'high-strung' to be dependable for daily-commuter use.  And I 
have never heard anything positive regarding the reliability of Audis, 
especially the modern models - too many 'bells and whistles'...they're not a 
consideration either, none of my friends who own them will recommend them to me.
 
Is there a significant correlation between the higher-performance models, and 
the amount of service/lack of reliability?  I think so - someone mentioned 
Brabus in an earlier post.  Brabus might be a great road-rocket, but....haven't 
you just turned a reliable/dependable machine into a fire-breathing hand 
grenade for an extra $60K+?  

M

--- On Wed, 12/23/09, Martin Stark <MStark [at] Copper.net> wrote:


From: Martin Stark <MStark [at] Copper.net>
Subject: Re: [Ferrari] German Cars
To: "Michael" <Cavallino_Rapante [at] yahoo.com>
Cc: "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
Date: Wednesday, December 23, 2009, 10:53 AM


Good luck finding any German car that can run 100K miles trouble free.  
I and my immediate family members have owned upwards of 10 cars from 
Audi, MB, and BMW, and currently own an A8 and M3.  Trouble free is not 
a phrase that can be associated with any of them - past or present. 

Michael James wrote:

>I was hoping of getting-into a German car in the next month or two - I 
>actually like the MB C280 4Matic or a 5-speed manual 3-Series BMW.  I think 
>either car would be practical and a good 'snow-car' with Blizzacks on the 
>rims.  I'm not looking to 'make statements' per se, or drive a land-yaht (I 
>don't know any fat people who need seat-space defined in cubic yards) - I just 
>want a 4-door car that is well-built, great in the snow, some Cache', some 
>modern/modest luxury, and can run for 100K miles trouble-free.  I'm finding 
>LOTS of C280s and 3-Series BMWs with sub-30K miles for around $20K, cars that 
>would appear to be leased vehicles that were gently-used.  
> 
>Keep in mind, my 'current' car is a 1996 stripped Ford Ranger with 250,000+ 
>miles on it.  A five-year-old Honda would be luxurious in comparison - I'm not 
>a 'bells-and-whistles' guy.  If the heater and A/C work, and there's a radio, 
>I'm pretty happy.  
> 
>M
> 
>P.S. - the Head work on my 308 is going well, I should have those finished in 
>January.  The Transfer Case and associated bearings will also be done by 
>spring.  Having a great deal of difficulty finding the correct Cylinder Liners 
>at an affordable price, though.
> 
> 
>
>
>--- On Wed, 12/23/09, TheMightyToe <themightytoe [at] gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>From: TheMightyToe <themightytoe [at] gmail.com>
>Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Michael Schumacher
>To: "Michael" <Cavallino_Rapante [at] yahoo.com>
>Cc: "The FerrariList" <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
>Date: Wednesday, December 23, 2009, 10:02 AM
>
>
>KR says:
>But fear not; the German cars  have video cameras to use backing up until 
>mirrors are invented. They have vibrators in the steering wheel that chide you 
>when you prove incapable of staying in your lane. They have forward-looking 
>xray lasers to part the waters when the road floods. And the tires are good 
>for 10,000 miles. Unless you get the run-flat option which rides like 
>Flintstone Rocktreads and cannot be fixed when punctured.
>
>Ken, you do realize that these exact "advances" are specifically 
>targetting the Houston area driver?  Flat perfect roads, occasional 
>floods mixed with year round perfect conditions, and the worst 
>collective driving ability on the planet?  Seriously last time I drove 
>there I saw some poor bastard on a Harley get taken out by a lady in an 
>SUV on her cell phone, leaving a tollbooth.  Last time I saw something 
>that horrible was on trip to India (where I imagine driver training is 
>marginally better than Houston's).
>
>But on BMW's I agree, that company jumped the Shark back in 2000.  My 
>E46 M3 was probably my last BMW, they just don't make a cool car 
>anymore.   MB has never appealed to me in any way, not even their 
>"classics" which are below any standard set by their contemporaries in 
>both looks and performance.  Who wants a car that lasts forever if its 
>hideous and you have to look at it forever?  They drive very solidly, 
>but have no soul whatsoever and really belong only in the hands of a 
>retiree.  Porsche and Audi are about the only German car companies 
>making interesting rides these days (I do like my VW GTI a lot, but it 
>is a standout for VW's line of cars I think). 
>
>Now here is something I pondered a few nights ago at the movie 
>theaters...   They played an add for Kia, and the ad was not for a car 
>but for the company.  The pitch was how great and modern their 
>manufacturing plant in the southern US was and how it provided jobs for 
>American workers...  So if I analyze this?  What they are actually 
>saying is it is cheaper for them to make cars in the deep south of the 
>US than in Korea?  Wow.  Just wow and how sad for us to be practically a 
>third world country in many respects... 
>
>That said, a neighbor of mine has a Hyundai Genesis Sedan, and it is 
>every bit as nice as a Merc S class.  Even looks like one a bit.
>
>Now what I really do not get, is how ANY car company could link F1 to 
>their product line?  When have we seen any F1 tech in a Mercedes if 
>ever?  Or a Renault, or a Toyota road car?
>
>BR,
>Mike
>
>
>Ken Rentiers wrote:
>  
>
>>Fellippe always enjoy your messages, but I have to disagree with this one. 
>>
>>It's certainly true that many of the old garden variety Benz's were slow, and 
>>about as exciting to drive as, well, a bank vault which is what they were 
>>built like. It is also true that many of the latest iteration of MB and BMW 
>>products are crap. 
>>
>>Due to the pressures of the Deutschland greenies much of the current BMW line 
>>is now made of recycled plastic. This includes the radiator. Given enough 
>>heat/cool cycles (oh say 50,000 miles worth) the eco-plastic becomes as 
>>brittle as the peanut variety of same, and cracks. Usually at the most 
>>inopportune time, giving you about 30 seconds to shut down before the head 
>>warps. 
>>
>>Did I mention they were as ugly as moose butts? Did I mention they had no 
>>dipsticks? Onliest way you can check the oil level is to drain it out and 
>>measure it! 
>>
>>Crap. Idiocy. Obergruppenarrogance!
>>
>>But fear not; the German cars  have video cameras to use backing up until 
>>mirrors are invented. They have vibrators in the steering wheel that chide 
>>you when you prove incapable of staying in your lane. They have 
>>forward-looking xray lasers to part the waters when the road floods. And the 
>>tires are good for 10,000 miles. Unless you get the run-flat option which 
>>rides like Flintstone Rocktreads and cannot be fixed when punctured.
>>
>>Crap!!! - gimme the older, simpler cars that you drove instead of rode in. 
>>The ones without bulbous snouts to meet new Euro-regs about not hitting below 
>>the pedestrians' knees. Like the ugly new 5 series. Don't cry for me 
>>Pininfarina - I got some nice old iron I shall keep forever. 
>>
>>Screw progress and while I'm at it HUMBUG! 
>>
>>Except for you Fellippe - you're a good guy even if you do latch on to a 
>>little misdirected opinion at times. My best to you and yours and have a 
>>wonderful Christmas. All the rest of you too, except those taken in by the 
>>Hollywood crap machine now showing "Eco-smurfs v The US Marines" (Avatar). 
>>##$%^&* tree-hugging commies every one of them. 
>>
>>:-)
>>love and kisses
>>the kenverine
>>
>>
>>On Dec 22, 2009, at 10:14 PM, Fellippe Galletta wrote:
>>
>>   
>>    
>>
>>>On Tue, Dec 22, 2009 at 8:46 AM, LS <lashdeep [at] yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>     
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Roger that...before they became plastic toasters?
>>>>
>>>>I'll take a 190E 2.3 16v and an AMG Hammer.
>>>>
>>>>LS
>>>>
>>>>       
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>Oh man.
>>>
>>>With some of you guys on here, it's like every civilian brand needs to
>>>maintain a 250 GTO like aura around their cars....ugh.
>>>
>>>Sure, MB of new isn't quite like MB of old but who seriously wants a 190E
>>>over a new E, S, CL, CLK, SL or CLS? LOL.
>>>
>>>A vintage Gullwing is a different story of course, and a genuine AMG Hammer
>>>or Porsche built E500 is worthy of consideration, but not all garden
>>>variety Benzes made between 1980-1999. You seriously want bulletproof, buy a
>>>new Japanese car...done, end of story.
>>>
>>>I'll play along and be a good sport and say the '90s S Class was the last of
>>>the uber Mercedes Benz elite class. When comparing each respective
>>>generation of S, this was easily the best, from the look, the armored car
>>>like construction, those dual pane windows, and the first big HP V12 in the
>>>600...the quintessential Benz.
>>>
>>>Still wouldn't get it over the newer S's. You're buying an
>>>expensive prestige sedan for the cachet/style/keeping up with the
>>>joneses/etc first, everything else comes second. Anyone who says otherwise
>>>is clearly lying to himself or others!
>>>
>>>The '90s S or Miami Vice era S's no longer fit the bill....so no point in
>>>owning these maintenance nightmares unless it's for the novelty factor and
>>>short term. For that LS, you did it right with those BMWs!
>>>
>>>It's time to expose the (forty) 800 pound gorilla for what it is! I don't
>>>hate those older Benzes...still respect them....but to act like they were
>>>the only good cars from the factory is silly.
>>>
>>>FG
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>
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