Ferrari Mailing List: Re: GUN DEBATE

[Dave Craig (dave.craig]

Clyde and others,

 

First, a Very Merry Christmas to all of you guys!!!!  I hope Santa brings you all a new Ferrari! J

 

Ok, a little bit of this is tongue-in-cheek, but not all of it.

 

I am actually finding it interesting that no one has posted that “I want an assault weapon to kill lots humans in a hurry!  And if I can get a hold of an Apache Helicopter, or a tank, or a flame thrower, I want that too!!!!  All fully loaded and ready to use!”  Santa are you listening? 

 

Follow me for a minute, throughout history, governments have failed.  Actually, given enough time it appears to be a given that all governments will fail.  When this happens, usually (almost all of the time), the new order takes charge by force.  We will call this reason #1 for civilians to be heavily armed and trained.  And more importantly, I (me, my family and close friends) want to be heavily armed (and trained) for this situation.  

 

And Sometimes the governments even become hostile towards the lay people (all of the lay people).  Its during those times that given enough pressure, the peasants will revolt.  Reason #2.    And if you take this to its final conclusion, then the peasants will actually be at war with the federal government!  So, the peasants need  to be as well armed at the federal government!  With the same firepower!  I believe this is what our founding fathers had in mind.  So, did they expect the individual to own an assault rifle?  You bet they did!  But let’s continue.

 

What about if/when society breaks down?  Reason #3.  What do I mean by society breaking down?  Let’s say for whatever reason, the law is nonexistent and you are truly on your own.  When this happens, he that has the biggest gun wins!  Some of the first reasons that come to mind would be natural disaster related.  So, a big natural disaster happens, it really doesn’t matter if its locally or nationally.  First comes the looting, then the actual high jacking of your food, supplies, whatever.  Taken by force or at gun point!  Imagine people killing each other over water and food.  Once again, the one with the biggest gun wins.

 

There are people that are preparing for the (fill in the blank) Apocalypse.  Reason #4.   The people have adopted the title of Preppers (yes they even have their own TV show and many websites http://americanpreppersnetwork.com/).  They are stock piling food, water, guns, ammo, etc.  I know several of these people and some of their arguments make sense.  What about a pandemic that actually kills 50%+ of the population?  What about a total financial collapse?  What about a large scale EMP (TV show Revolution)?  What about Yellow Stone (a super volcano) erupting?  Global Thermonuclear War?  Large asteroid impact?  All of these just point out that life and society can be fragile and in each of these, society will breakdown.  You best bet at survival will be if you are an isolationist with massive fire power. 

 

And then my personal favorite and fear is the impending Zombie Apocalypse.  With the impending Zombie Apocalypse, you will have to fight your way to safety using everything in your firepower.  Have you not seen Zombie Land?  Remember it takes a head shot to put them down!!!!  Don’t forget to double tap!!!!!  I call this one reason #5.  Yes, you could say it fits well within reason #4, but I think it gets special treatment.  This one clearly points out the need to have massive fire power.  I want a gun that can kill a thousand zombies without reloading!     

 

In the 70s we had the same scare related to the cold war.  Remember the movie Red Dawn (not that bad remake that came out this year)?  I knew several people (back then) that own machine guns, some legally and some not so legally.  There were individuals that owned tanks, there were individuals that own fighter jets, and there were individuals that own all sorts of actual military weapons.  Especially WW2 “vintage” weaponry.  Still very effective at killing people. 

 

The US has always been the land of the gun.  No other country has embraced the idea of the general public having the rights to own whatever gun that individual wants like the US has. 

 

So, like many have said before, you cannot blame the “gun” for the issues at hand.  You have to blame the  individual committing that act.  Let’s call him/her the bad guy, or more technically, the criminal!   So, by legislating laws that pertain to anything, and I repeat anything, it really doesn’t have an effect on the CRIMINAL.  If you think it will, then you really don’t understand English or at least what the word CRIMINAL means.  By its very definition, the criminal will commit crimes, and a crime is the breaking of rules or laws for which some governing authority (via mechanisms such as legal systems) can ultimately prescribe a conviction.  So, anyone that thinks that making more laws will stop a murderer, when murder is and has always been against the law, is just really stupid or at least in total denial!

 

I personally think that anyone that doesn’t have at a minimum of 1000 rounds of ammunition is totally un prepared for anything!   That being said, I am not considered a Prepper by anyone that I know of!

 

As I said at the beginning, Merry Christmas!!!!

 

This should be fun! J

 

Dave

 

 

 

 

 

From: cjromero [mailto:clyderomerof4 [at] bellsouth.net]
Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 8:35 AM
To: Dave Craig
Cc: 'The FerrariList'
Subject: Re: [Ferrari] GUN DEBATE

 

Here is the real question

Does anyone other than the military need an M-16 type weapon ?

I was in a Bass Pro shop the other day after qualifying for the program I am in and you can buy a level 3 Night Vision Scope 4x

Now you tell me what civilian needs this type of capability?

I am open to hearing what you have to say.

 

I have 3 ½ combat tours

I was a scout helicopter pilot my first tour in Vietnam and engaged the enemy up close and personnel.

So I know what it is to kill and be shot! ( 3 purple hearts)

The other 2 in RF-4C Phantoms and a partial ground tour in Iraq in 2005

 

I am all ears

 

Clyde taking cover and requesting an airstrike DANGER CLOSE!

 

 

 

 

From: dale sailors [mailto:sailorsdaleedward [at] yahoo.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2012 1:31 AM
To: Clyde
Cc: The FerrariList
Subject: [Ferrari] GUN DEBATE

 

SEASONS GREETINGS.

     UNFORTUNATELY THE USA HAS HAD A RASH OF

SHOOTINGS WITH INNOCENT VICTIMS KILLED OR INJURED.

     AND THE SPECIAL INTERESTS ARE ABOUT TO TRY

TO MORE STRICTLY REGULATE FIREARMS, ACCESSORIES

SUCH AS CLIPS AND AMMO.

     AND OF COURSE VERY FEW ARE INTERESTED IN

POSITIONING TRAINED ARMED SECURITY AT SCHOOLS,

MALLS, PUBLIC PLACES, ETC.

     AND LESS ARE INTERESTED IN ADDRESSING THE

HORDES OF MENTALLY OR EMOTIONALLY CHALLENGED

SOCIOPATHS THE HEALTH CARE SYSTEM HAS DUMPED

ON THE PUBLIC STREETS. I ACKNOWLEDGE MOST OF

THE MENTALLY OR EMOTIONALLY ILL ARE NOT A THREAT

OR AT WORST, ARE A THREAT TO THEMSELVES BUT

THESE ARE THE OTHER FOLKS.

     BUT SPECIFICALLY CONCERNING GUNS.

     FOR SEVERAL YEARS I WAS TRIBAL

ADMINISTRATOR AND LAW ENFORCEMENT ON

TWO RESERVATIONS IN THE USA AND MEXICO.

EVERY FAMILY HAD SEVERAL 30-30 RILES AND

AMMO IN EVERY RESIDENCE. MOST ALSO HAD

OTHER HUNTING OR ASSAULT RIFLES, SHOTGUNS

OR 22 CALIBER RIFLES. A FEW HAD PISTOLS AND

ONE MACHINE GUN EXISTED. DESPITE HIGH LEVELS

OF INHALENT ABUSE AND ALCOHOLISM AMONG THE

TRIBE AND DETERIORATING SOCIAL MORES

COMPLICATED BY INTERNAL POLITICAL

CIVIL WAR AMONG THE MEMBERS, I NEVER HAD

A FIREARM RELATED CRIME. THERE WERE SEVERAL

SERIOUS ASSAULTS WITH KNIVES AND A SCREWDRIVER

(DISEMBOWELMENTS, STABBINGS, SCALPINGS) AND

MOTOR VEHICLES. ONE EVENT INVOLVED ROCKS!

I NEVER HAD TO FIRE A SHOT ALTHOUGH I KEPT

A PISTOL GRIP SHOTGUN AND 44 MAGNUM HANDGUN

HANDY. SURPRISINGLY THE CRIMINALS WERE MORE

AFRAID OF A RED TOMAHAWK FOR CULTURAL REASONS.

      I REALISE THIS SOUNDS UNBELIEVABLE IN THE

RECENT PAST IN THE USA OR EVEN MEXICO BUT IT

DID HAPPEN.

      DESPITE A READY AVAILABILITY OF FIREARMS

TO A SEVERELY CHALLENGED POPULATION OF 750

INDIVIDUALS---NO FIREARM CRIMES OCCURRED OVER

SEVERAL YEARS.

      GUNS DON'T CAUSE CRIMES.

      SOCIOPATHIC PERSONS DO.

      NOW WHAT I WOULD SUGGEST TO REALISTICALLY

IMPROVE PUBLIC SAFETY LOOKING AT WEAPONS ONLY.

1/ REQUIRE A THOROUGH BACKGROUND CHECK TO BUY

   BUY ANY WEAPONS, AMMO, ACCESSORIES SUCH AS

   CLIPS, OR POLICE OR MILITARY EQUIPMENT.

   MICROCHIP QUALIFIED PERSONS. AT EVERY PURCHASE,

   SELLER WOULD VERIFY MICROCHIP STATUS AND

   REPORT PURCHASE TO ATF AND FBI.

2/ MICROCHIP ALL CONVICTED FELONS, PERSONS

   MEDICALLY OR JUDICIALLY DECLARED POTENTIALLY

   DANGEROUS, FAMILY VIOLENCE OFFENDERS AND KNOWN

   MEMBERS OF CRIMINAL OR SUBVERSIVE GROUPS AND

   MARK THEM INELGIBLE TO PURCHASE OR OWN THE

   ABOVE ITEMS. REQUIRE A SEVERE PENALTY FOR

   VIOLATIONS. EQUIP ALL POLICE WITH MICROCHIP

   SCANNERS TO ALLOW FIELD VERIFICATION OF STATUS.

3/ REQUIRE SAFE STORAGE OF ABOVE LISTED ITEMS

   BY AUTHORIZED OWNERS. GUN SAFES, GUN TRIGGER

   LOCKS, ETC.

4/ REQUIRE SAFE HUNTING AND SAFE WEAPON HANDLING

   COURSES PRIOR TO FIRST PURCHASE OF LISTED ITEMS.

5/ REQUIRE MANDATORY DEATH PENALTY FOR ALL FELONS

   CONVICTED OF ANY CRIME INVOLVING A WEAPON.

   SENTENCE TO BE EXECUTED WITHIN 90 DAYS OF

   CONVICTION INCLUDING ONE PROCEDURAL

   APPEAL/REVIEW. EXECUTION TO BE PUBLICALLY

   TELEVISED.

THAT SHOULD SOLVE THE PROBLEM.

RESPECTFULLY,

DALE E SAILORS