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Re: Interior Quality = Engineering? was George's Spitfire vs Vette Shootout
From: Robert W. Garven Jr. (rgarvengmail.com)
Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2014 17:47:59 -0800 (PST)

Robert W. Garven Jr.


 "The Ferrari is a dream - people dream of owning this special vehicle and for most people it will remain a dream apart from for those lucky few." Enzo Ferrari






On Jan 5, 2014, at 11:07 PM, Fellippe Galletta wrote:

It's been a long time since Mercedes Benz and perhaps BMW were considered elite engineering, at least when it came to reliability and build quality.

Nowadays they are just big, fast, prestigious cars but hardly anything to write home about as far as being bulletproof. 

Accounting and planned obsolescence are two brutal b****es that can't be ignored in modern manufacturing. Combine that with the elite brands that constantly cater to customers who want more and more "stuff" in their cars and are willing to tolerate whatever to have the cool cars, and you can see where the problems lie. 

I also believe that the modern luxury car buyer mentality is more in line with swapping cars out every 2-3 years, instead of keeping for 150-200k miles. That has to have an effect on build quality/design/engineering.

The Mercedes Benz 240D is the hallmark of longevity. It's totally not my cup of tea but that incredible build quality is somewhat inspiring.

FG


On Sun, Jan 5, 2014 at 5:59 PM, LS <lashdeep [at] yahoo.com> wrote:
George, your example is perfect.

The car with the better door panels is of higher quality and design?

We can see that in Spitfire vs. Corvette!

The exact opposite is more true in reality...seems that a cheaper interior will yield the better engineering elsewhere.

Where would you want the manufacturer's skills to be displayed?

Main bearing tolerances or door panel fasteners?

Suspension design or ashtray lighting?

If interiors are absolutely your #1 priority in a car, then I can accept that.

A disgruntled ex BMW buddy of mine sent me this recently:


He sold all of his BMWs and MBs after years of big bills across many cars.

LS


On Jan 5, 2014, at 16:18, George <ygpz4re [at] hotmail.com> wrote:

Lashdeep,

Concur fully.  If GM can't make a door panel that stays in place on a car that's not even 20 years old yet (and yet a small British maker like Triumph can), what else have they totally "Fouled" up??

Regards,

George P.

On Jan 5, 2014, at 4:09 PM, "LS" <lashdeep [at] yahoo.com> wrote:

George,  I'm afraid that if you are worried about floppy panels, the other more serious engineering problems out there will scare the life out of you.

What does everyone think about plastic interior panels like some of the 996 Porsche models? As long as they don't loosen up? What if they chip and lose their finish but still stay fixed in their original position?

What if the interior parts melt(like in a Ferrari)...but don't become floppy?

Does anyone need a drink right now?

Can my interior race your interior?

How can the market put such a high priority on interior quality yet spend $100k, like Adam did, on the mechanical maintenance of their Cayenne?

I'm not a big 911 fan, but even I cannot deny a well sorted early 911 S or a 930. They are AMAZING cars.

I am not going to fight it and convince myself they aren't engineered to be fun and successful.

If interior quality is #1 priority, then so be it.

If you don't like a car just because, then just admit it...

I will...and that's prob why I won't buy a Corvette !!!

LS

 



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From: George <ygpz4re [at] hotmail.com>
To: LS <lashdeep [at] yahoo.com>
Cc: The FerrariList <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 5, 2014 1:36 PM
Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Ferrari Digest, Vol 90, Issue 24

Regarding FG's comment below about Vette interiors, I have just the following to add:  one of my best friends has a '96 Vette "Collector Edition", with LT-4 engine.  Gobs of power and torque and fun to drive, but when you close the driver side door, the interior door panel flops loose.  Even my POS 70's vintage Spitfire doesn't do that.  Of course it also lacks the power/torque, but Jeesh, you'd think a company the size of GM could do better than that.  I think the new Vettes are really terrific cars, but like LS, I just couldn't see myself ever owning one, just on general principles (that it's a GM product).  How long before a C7 has a floppy door panel, or worse??

My 2 lira.

Regards,

George P.

>
> I've been around a lot of real picky in the a*** car guys who have hated on
> Vette interiors since the dawn of time,
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