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Re: Converting a US 308 motor to a Euro 308 motor
From: Doug & Terri (dntdock.net)
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2014 17:38:14 -0700 (PDT)

Picture this – 1999, we have left Brescia and the Mille Miglia is going full tilt towards Rome.  We head off towards the factory.  Sheeeesh – it’s like Disneyland.  Check your cameras here ‘per favore.’  (When I went thru the factory in 1979 I asked if I could take my camera – sure.  Took a whole roll of pictures.  Kodachrome slides of course) but back to the 360’s. 

 

As our ‘tour’ group went thru the final assembly the already painted cars are, well, just assembled.  The finished cars exit the door and are parked willy nilly out in the yard between a couple of buildings.  Looking out there – all these pastels and colors of the rainbow (was there even a red car there?) they looked like a pile of Easter Eggs.  Ayep – blues, light greens, and on and on and on.

 

DOUG

 

From: Ferrari [mailto:ferrari-bounces+dnt=dock.net [at] ferrarilist.com] On Behalf Of Erik Nielsen
Sent: Thursday, September 4, 2014 3:25 PM
To: DOUG
Cc: The FerrariList
Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Converting a US 308 motor to a Euro 308 motor

 

360s in blue are starting to look appealing...

Sent from my iPad


On Sep 4, 2014, at 2:57 PM, LS <lashdeep [at] yahoo.com> wrote:

Then you would have an ugly 360...maybe a 360 motor into the 308?

 



central

wines-spirits   est 1934

 

625 e street nw

washington, dc 20004

 

 

 

202-737-2800

 

 

 

From: Erik Nielsen <judge4re [at] gmail.com>
To: LS <lashdeep [at] yahoo.com>
Cc: The FerrariList <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 4, 2014 2:55 PM
Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Converting a US 308 motor to a Euro 308 motor

 

Wouldn't it just be cheaper to get a 360 with a 6 speed manual?

 

On Thu, Sep 4, 2014 at 1:23 PM, Matt Boyd <ferrari308driver [at] gmail.com> wrote:

I really like the thread on f-chat of the guy in California that had Nick's Forza Ferrari do a full workup on his 308 to include a 4.0L bore in his 308 motor. I think they're finally putting the car on the dyno today, but it is normally aspirated and "de-tuned" to approximately 440HP (computer simulation). The real test will be on the real dyno. To do that requires tons of additional work as detailed in that thread, but also requires tons of additional $$ (the guy wouldn't answer the "how much" question but concurred it was well over $50k). The curious part of all of it is that he wasn't initially looking for all this power, but instead frustrated with high levels of maintenance, and he was faced with a ~$25k rebuild due to a failed head gasket and so he asked Nick how to make it more reliable. Part of the upgrades is custom cam pulleys (and cam belt drive gears) to incorporate modern cam belt technology which means normal 90k service intervals. That would be almost as exciting as tire smoke....almost....

 

On Thu, Sep 4, 2014 at 2:14 PM, LS <lashdeep [at] yahoo.com> wrote:

Matt, my advice is to get a spare motor and go big...REAL BIG.

 

4.0 Liter, lighter con rods, crank, Motec, Electromotive or BIG WEBERS

 

You will not regret it.

 

Clyde's advice, as always, is good for reliability but when was that really a top concern?

 

When was the last time you started your car and then took your shirt off and yelled "YEAH M-F'er....I JUST SUCCESSFULLY STARTED MY CAR!!!"

 

Tire smoke all day...

 

LS

 



central

wines-spirits   est 1934

 

625 e street nw

washington, dc 20004

 

 

 

202-737-2800

 

 

 

From: Matt Boyd <ferrari308driver [at] gmail.com>

Sent: Thursday, September 4, 2014 1:48 PM


Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Converting a US 308 motor to a Euro 308 motor

 

That's the crux of my discussion point. I already have the Euro car with all the fun cosmetic upgrades like the front spoiler, euro bumpers, driving lights, flash to pass lights, etc. I also already have the non-restrictive emissions (no cats). I also don't have the heavier bumpers or door reinforcments. I want to focus ONLY on the motor.

 

If I put a US motor in my car, would I have to do any mods to make it work out of the box? If I put a US motor in my car, could I put my Euro cams into the motor with no additional work and make it identical to a Euro motor?

 

-Matt

 

On Thu, Sep 4, 2014 at 1:36 PM, LS via Ferrari <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> wrote:

 

The Euro cars are lighter without a doubt which helps performance but the engine is quite different.

 

The cam timing is much more aggressive and the exhaust is less restrictive. US vs Euro idle quality is like a race motor vs a Camry.

 

LS

 



central

wines-spirits   est 1934

 

625 e street nw

washington, dc 20004

 

 

 

202-737-2800

 

 

 

From: Fellippe Galletta <fellippe.galletta [at] gmail.com>

Sent: Thursday, September 4, 2014 7:17 AM


Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Converting a US 308 motor to a Euro 308 motor

 

You serious about the TR power difference?

 

Wow, I never heard that. Pretty crazy.

 

I think with 308s, it's possible that there's a healthy gap as well probably because of the smog equipment and how it was dealt with. At least on the carbureted cars....the injected shouldn't be too far off. 

 

And agree about the displacement. Now that a lot of equity has been made owning a 3x8 car, makes a lot of sense turning one into a 3.4 or 3.5 liter beast.

 

FG

 

On Thu, Sep 4, 2014 at 12:08 AM, LS via Ferrari <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com> wrote:

 

10bhp is what Ferrari claimed was the difference was between the US and Euro spec TR.

 

Felt like 50bhp in reality...

 

If you are rebuilding already...why wouldn't you punch the displacement out a bit for more power??

 

LS

 



central

wines-spirits   est 1934

 

625 e street nw

washington, dc 20004

 

 

 

202-737-2800

 

 

 

From: Mark <misc [at] 308systems.com>
To: LS <lashdeep [at] yahoo.com>
Cc: 'The FerrariList' <ferrari [at] ferrarilist.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 3, 2014 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Ferrari] Converting a US 308 motor to a Euro 308 motor

 

Perhaps I am being crass, but the difference is only a claimed 10hp, which probably translates into 3-5hp.  Not noticeable.  Go for the best engine you can easily find.

 

My .02,

 

Mark

 

 

From: Ferrari [mailto:ferrari-bounces+misc=308systems.com [at] ferrarilist.com] On Behalf Of Matt Boyd
Sent: Wednesday, September 03, 2014 10:59 AM
To: Mark
Cc: The FerrariList
Subject: [Ferrari] Converting a US 308 motor to a Euro 308 motor

 

Just thinking out loud.

 

My car has a Euro 308 motor and I'm glad to have that potential extra power. I need to replace rings in the motor, and as Clyde astutely pointed out, the labor of that type of job is likely to FAR outweigh the cost of getting a replacement long block and dropping it in.

 

It is easier to find a US 308 motor, so if I were to purchase a US motor, what would I have to do to make it a Euro motor? Obviously I have my euro cams already and could drop them in if that's about all it took. How much more involved is this job f converting a US spec motor to Euro spec?

 

-Matt

'85 euro 308

 

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